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	<title>Comments on: Tricked by consciousness</title>
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	<link>http://bitsofmymind.com/2009/10/27/tricked-by-consciousness/</link>
	<description>self explanatory</description>
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		<title>By: Omikun</title>
		<link>http://bitsofmymind.com/2009/10/27/tricked-by-consciousness/comment-page-1/#comment-179</link>
		<dc:creator>Omikun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Jul 2010 01:41:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thoughts and feelings are the result of interaction of matter in the brain. Just like the execution of a program is the result of computation of instructions on data sets. Ultimately, consciousness must arise from thoughts, as seen from infants to toddlers when they acquire a sense of self and a sense of permanence. Humans do not begin with consciousness but develop it in childhood.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thoughts and feelings are the result of interaction of matter in the brain. Just like the execution of a program is the result of computation of instructions on data sets. Ultimately, consciousness must arise from thoughts, as seen from infants to toddlers when they acquire a sense of self and a sense of permanence. Humans do not begin with consciousness but develop it in childhood.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas</title>
		<link>http://bitsofmymind.com/2009/10/27/tricked-by-consciousness/comment-page-1/#comment-26</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 16 Mar 2010 20:10:47 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Your right, apprehension is the wrong term. As a philosopher, one spends much time trying to find the Perfect Terms. The more correct term for this concecpt would be &quot;immediate experience&quot;. 

A machine does not have the ability, and nothing material ever will, to immediatly experience anything. The thing with experience, is that it must flow through you. But by definition, nothing flows through particules of matter. 

But the ego of scientism is too great isn`t it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your right, apprehension is the wrong term. As a philosopher, one spends much time trying to find the Perfect Terms. The more correct term for this concecpt would be &#8220;immediate experience&#8221;. </p>
<p>A machine does not have the ability, and nothing material ever will, to immediatly experience anything. The thing with experience, is that it must flow through you. But by definition, nothing flows through particules of matter. </p>
<p>But the ego of scientism is too great isn`t it?</p>
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		<title>By: Antoine</title>
		<link>http://bitsofmymind.com/2009/10/27/tricked-by-consciousness/comment-page-1/#comment-24</link>
		<dc:creator>Antoine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 18:47:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Apprehension is defined as acceptance of or receptivity to information without passing judgment on its validity, often without complete comprehension. [Dictionary.com] 

Apprehension in psychologoy is a term applied to a model of consciousness in which nothing is affirmed or denied of the object in question, but the mind is merely aware of (&quot;seizes&quot;) it. [Wikipedia] 

Accoding to those two definitions, a machine can apprehend its environement. You must have meant understanding. 

Then again, understanding has a few definitions and many of those are applicable to computers except of course for the religious one.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_gifts_of_the_Holy_Spirit) However, this religious definition presupposes Creation or a similar event and this comes at odds with the premise this post is based on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Apprehension is defined as acceptance of or receptivity to information without passing judgment on its validity, often without complete comprehension. [Dictionary.com] </p>
<p>Apprehension in psychologoy is a term applied to a model of consciousness in which nothing is affirmed or denied of the object in question, but the mind is merely aware of (&#8220;seizes&#8221;) it. [Wikipedia] </p>
<p>Accoding to those two definitions, a machine can apprehend its environement. You must have meant understanding. </p>
<p>Then again, understanding has a few definitions and many of those are applicable to computers except of course for the religious one.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_gifts_of_the_Holy_Spirit) However, this religious definition presupposes Creation or a similar event and this comes at odds with the premise this post is based on.</p>
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		<title>By: Nicholas</title>
		<link>http://bitsofmymind.com/2009/10/27/tricked-by-consciousness/comment-page-1/#comment-25</link>
		<dc:creator>Nicholas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Dec 2009 17:02:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>As most Atheists do, you confuse intelligence with consciousness. For example, a machine can be intelligent, but it cannot be conscious. On the other hand, I do not know if a consciousness could exist with intelligence? 

You speak of the necessity of observation. But do you even understand the essence of human observation? The essence of consciousness, is human observation, i.e. our ability to apprehend ideas. Take a machine for example. It does not observe. The closest it can get to that is by being fitted with a sensor (ex: a webcam) and a processor to process what is sensed. You can put as much sensors, and hardware and software in it, as intelligent as it may be, it will never apprehend. It will only sense and process. The human body senses and process&#039; not so different than a machine could hope to do. But the body does not apprehend anything, it senses and process&#039;. The apprehension is done at another level, a conscious level. No one knows for sure what happens at that conscious level from a reductionist perspective because the conscious level is purely subjective; (continued) 

thier is no objective processing. Whatever processing takes place at the conscious level is somehow determined by the will of the conscious being and what is apprehended. To the body, this conscious level&#039;s output is sensed and another input into the system, although with more powerfull rules I suppose. To the conscious level, the body is an input that is somehow consolidated into what it is you and I are apprehending right now. What makes this consciousness so special? It can only exist in the present, at one time. You see yourself see when you should see your conscious self apprehending. 

Consciousness is not an material element. It is not a string, a particule, an electron, an atom, a wave, a molecule, a protein, a dna strand or anything material. Consciousness is a feeling, an observation, an apprehension, an acknowledgement, a sentiment, etc. Such a thing is not a result of evolution, just like a particule is not the result of evolution. 

Consciousness is not determined by an arrangement of matter in the body. It is the arrangement matter in the body that is determined by consciousness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As most Atheists do, you confuse intelligence with consciousness. For example, a machine can be intelligent, but it cannot be conscious. On the other hand, I do not know if a consciousness could exist with intelligence? </p>
<p>You speak of the necessity of observation. But do you even understand the essence of human observation? The essence of consciousness, is human observation, i.e. our ability to apprehend ideas. Take a machine for example. It does not observe. The closest it can get to that is by being fitted with a sensor (ex: a webcam) and a processor to process what is sensed. You can put as much sensors, and hardware and software in it, as intelligent as it may be, it will never apprehend. It will only sense and process. The human body senses and process&#8217; not so different than a machine could hope to do. But the body does not apprehend anything, it senses and process&#8217;. The apprehension is done at another level, a conscious level. No one knows for sure what happens at that conscious level from a reductionist perspective because the conscious level is purely subjective; (continued) </p>
<p>thier is no objective processing. Whatever processing takes place at the conscious level is somehow determined by the will of the conscious being and what is apprehended. To the body, this conscious level&#8217;s output is sensed and another input into the system, although with more powerfull rules I suppose. To the conscious level, the body is an input that is somehow consolidated into what it is you and I are apprehending right now. What makes this consciousness so special? It can only exist in the present, at one time. You see yourself see when you should see your conscious self apprehending. </p>
<p>Consciousness is not an material element. It is not a string, a particule, an electron, an atom, a wave, a molecule, a protein, a dna strand or anything material. Consciousness is a feeling, an observation, an apprehension, an acknowledgement, a sentiment, etc. Such a thing is not a result of evolution, just like a particule is not the result of evolution. </p>
<p>Consciousness is not determined by an arrangement of matter in the body. It is the arrangement matter in the body that is determined by consciousness.</p>
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